[Andrewinspace]

IF Gretna get into the South of Scotland League, do you think they'll contribute much to league in the way of interest and fans?

Or will their support just disapear from where it came from. leaving only the loyal pre-mileson mob?

I personally think they'll be able to muster a decent bit of suppport and certainly will bring a wee bit more attention from the local press to the south league but i think this press attention will die down when their beloved are struggling to make progress in the league by christmas.

Well thats my prediction. But then then again thats even IF they get in.

[EdinburghBlue]

Andrewinspace, on Jun 18 2008, 21:32, said:

IF Gretna get into the South of Scotland League, do you think they'll contribute much to league in the way of interest and fans?

Or will their support just disapear from where it came from. leaving only the loyal pre-mileson mob?

I personally think they'll be able to muster a decent bit of suppport and certainly will bring a wee bit more attention from the local press to the south league but i think this press attention will die down when their beloved are struggling to make progress in the league by christmas.

Well thats my prediction. But then then again thats even IF they get in.

The community is big enough to support a decent SoS side. The mistake was letting them into the SFL.

[Hugo Biano]

Being part of the SFL has enabled Gretna to generate a local loyal fanbase and i believe this would make them a great asset to the SOS league.My only worry is that before joining the SFL and playing at a much better level than the SOS league they would be lucky to get 50 fans watching a game.

You may find that these so called die hards may start following Q.O.S or even Annan if they were to gain League status.

Good luck to Gretna in their quest as there definately going to need it.

[ziggs ball]

for anyone old enough to remember gretna communty fc used to be in the sos league in the early 90's, they didn't get many fans and only lasted a season.after all thats gone on with the other gretna i just cant see them getting fans again and just cant see where they'll get players from,there used to be a few amateur teams they could get players from down that way i.e eastriggs,kirkpatrick fleming,chaplecross, glaxo,hoddam all teams that now do not exist so the players just aren't there,having said that if places like creetown,gatehouse,new abbey and glencaple can field teams there's no reason why gretna com cant if they raid carlisle for players annan dont want.we'll see! * come on the queens*

[Duncan Freemason]

ziggs ball, on Jun 19 2008, 20:56, said:

for anyone old enough to remember gretna communty fc used to be in the sos league in the early 90's, they didn't get many fans and only lasted a season.after all thats gone on with the other gretna i just cant see them getting fans again and just cant see where they'll get players from,there used to be a few amateur teams they could get players from down that way i.e eastriggs,kirkpatrick fleming,chaplecross, glaxo,hoddam all teams that now do not exist so the players just aren't there,having said that if places like creetown,gatehouse,new abbey and glencaple can field teams there's no reason why gretna com cant if they raid carlisle for players annan dont want.we'll see! * come on the queens*

I think they WILL get into the SoS. I think for a wee while, they'll have 100 or 200 watching them. I think by mid season, that number will barely make it into three figures. The following season, with nowhere to go, I reckon three figures will be beyond them. If Raydale goes, adjust the figures down by a third. And that's the dilemma the council might be facing. There might be 70 or so who will follow the club wherever they play, and maybe 100 who will go if games ar at Raydale. in effect, the council might have to pay a significant seven figure sum to appease thirty or forty people.

[Duncan Freemason]

Duncan Freemason, on Jun 20 2008, 17:24, said:

I think they WILL get into the SoS. I think for a wee while, they'll have 100 or 200 watching them. I think by mid season, that number will barely make it into three figures. The following season, with nowhere to go, I reckon three figures will be beyond them. If Raydale goes, adjust the figures down by a third. And that's the dilemma the council might be facing. There might be 70 or so who will follow the club wherever they play, and maybe 100 who will go if games ar at Raydale. in effect, the council might have to pay a significant seven figure sum to appease thirty or forty people.

And having said all the above a couple of days ago, and now having visited their two forums half an hour ago, you have to say that it looks like no-one actually cares. Their old Footy Mad forum seems to be a few outsiders asking questions with Gretna supporters input being next to nothing. Their new forum which someone claimed was "going great guns" is like a cemetary. With their supposed new team on the way, you'd expect a bit of lively debate, but there is absolutely nothing. It's busiest day seems to have been it's first day with 21 punters showing face. The busiest thread seems to be "word association".
Furthermore, another presumably young guy has set up a 3rd forum and launched it five or six days ago. At time of writing, there hasn't been a single solitary posting. If nothing else, you'd have thought these dyed in the wool fans would have gone there and said "thanks for trying" at least one time.
Much of the bluster after administration has gone. Raydale looks a more and more distant prospect by the day. The Supporters Society are going to run the new club. The Fighting 46 are headed in another direction, and if that direction is a recreation facility for something other than the new club, then it has to be said, that the Fighting 46 might be more in tune with the town's needs than the "new team" people.
It actually looks like the enthusiasm has gone after a brief couple of weeks. They will be doing well to stop the whole venture crashing and burning in a matter of days or weeks.
If they make it to the SoS, don't be surprised if their new ground has swings and a sandpit close by.
Doubtless they'll think that their business is conducted in meetings, not internet forums. But surely somebody not on a committee is interested in what is happening. Or maybe the lure of word association games is a stronger pull these days. Personally, I think their new club might already be struggling just as much as their old one. Dangerous days for football in Gretna.

This post has been edited by Duncan Freemason: 22 June 2008 - 16:31

[BadgersNadgers]

Don't think a ground will be a problem for them, SOS League allows pretty much public parks as long as they have a rope around them. Surely there's a Sunday League pitch somewhere in the border area they could use?

Has there actually been any concrete talk of an AFC Gretna, and if so, who is involved?

Edit:
To answer my own question, from here

Quote

Rome leaves for re-formed Gretna team (Thu 12 Jun)

Stuart Rome, Reds' Reserve team manager, has resigned to become the manager at a reformed Gretna football team. Stuart leaves the Reds with the best wishes of Reds' chairman Humprey Dobie and Reserves' secretary Herbert Briggs.

The Gretna Supporters Society are to reform a football team in Gretna after support for the proposal was shown at a meeting held on Wednesday 11th June. An Extraordinary General Meeting of the Gretna Supporters Society Trust board is to be held on the 2nd July. http://www.gretnasup...ssociety.co.uk/

So something must be happening for him to do that?

And according to this site they've having a Car Boot Sale fundraiser down Raydale on the 29th June

This post has been edited by BadgersNadgers: 23 June 2008 - 19:18

[Duncan Freemason]

BadgersNadgers, on Jun 23 2008, 20:13, said:

Don't think a ground will be a problem for them, SOS League allows pretty much public parks as long as they have a rope around them. Surely there's a Sunday League pitch somewhere in the border area they could use?

Has there actually been any concrete talk of an AFC Gretna, and if so, who is involved?

Edit:
To answer my own question, from here


So something must be happening for him to do that?

And according to this site they've having a Car Boot Sale fundraiser down Raydale on the 29th June

Their "new manager' will be taking up a voluntary unpaid position. Nor do I think a ground will be a problem, but using Raydale most certainly will be. It's in a hell of a state, and not likely to get much better in the short term. Don't know why, but I have a feeling that the ground will end up being sold. Maybe a lawyer somewhere along the line has screwed up, but given that ownership now sits with Gretna FC Ltd in the Land Registry, I reckon tearing it free of the hands of the administrator for nowt might well be a non starter. There seems to be a hell of a lot of activists who don't live anywhere near Gretna, and are either getting a buzz from being involved, or simply crave the limelight. If it's the former, then they have a chance. But there is no doubt that despite what some might say, there is definitely more than a difference of opinion going on between the various groups, and non gretna people might be close to be considered hi-jackers of the town's footie team.
I have been fascinated by the story from the get go, but have to admit that it's all becoming tedious and tiresome now. That's reflected in press coverage too, where interest has fallen to the point where locally, they get a wee mention, and nationally, no-one really gives a monkey's any more. Well done Mileson. What a legacy.
A car boot fundraiser........it says it all. Now they are raising cash in the same way as the Cubs and Scouts, and the amount they raise will be on a par with those other organisations. Thing is, there's more than one group raising funds, so who do people donate to?
Here's a thing. Surely the Gretna Supporters Society were tied to the old club. Since that has dissolved, shouldn't they have dissolved too? Do they really have a mandate to just carry on? Sure, their board or committee would have been given the authority to do certain things in support of Gretna FC, but was marching on regardless after the club's demise really within their remit? Not saying they had no right to, or what they have done is wrong, but just wondering if they actually just decided off their own backs to remain the elected ones for the new club. Sure as eggs are eggs, there will be people who won't take to kindly to it if there's even a hint of a new kind of glory hunting in town.
And you have to presume that they have some sort of permission to occupy and charge for table participation in the forthcoming car boot sale at Raydale. Until proven otherwise, the ground does sit with the administrators after all.
Jeez, from taking Steve Tosh away from Aberdeen by paying him more than the Dons could when gretna were in the lower leagues, to car boot sales to generate funds. Oh how the dream has ended...........

This post has been edited by Duncan Freemason: 24 June 2008 - 14:43

[Duncan Freemason]

Are people actually putting any thought into what they are doing? I mean in detail. I see on top of the car boot sale, where the money is being made solely from charging a fiver to get your car or table in, they are doing a "sponsored walk". Yeah, fine....but is it really fine? There's a form for the walk that reads thus:
GRETNA SUPPORTERS SOCIETY
ACTION GROUP
SAVE OUR CLUB
FUNDRAISING
Sponsored Walk
Sunday 6th.July 2008
Start Time 10.30 a.m.
Start/Finish:Gretna Green Visitors Centre

"Save Our Club". How daft is that? Do they still not get it? Are there people there who are still so blinkered that they think "their club" is still in existance? It's not about "saving" anything.......unless this is yet another offshoot doing their own thing. There is nothing left to save. That has HUGE connotations of throwing good money after bad. If it's a sponsored walk to raise funds to help create a new amateur side in Gretna, then SAY SO. If it's about raising money to go and tilt at windmills in order to save Mileson's Gretna FC, then that's ok then, because that is exactly the message that the sponsored walk organisers are giving out. Not only that, but yet again, the key person is from Hexham, not Gretna. I think the good people of the village are going to get mightily hacked off pretty soon at what looks like a hell of a lot of people from elsewhere telling them what is going to happen in their village when it comes to recreation. Football lover or not, if I lived there, I think I'd be getting pretty pi$$ed off with it already.

[KingfaetheSooth]

Duncan Freemason, on Jun 24 2008, 12:41, said:

Their "new manager' will be taking up a voluntary unpaid position. Nor do I think a ground will be a problem, but using Raydale most certainly will be. It's in a hell of a state, and not likely to get much better in the short term. Don't know why, but I have a feeling that the ground will end up being sold. Maybe a lawyer somewhere along the line has screwed up, but given that ownership now sits with Gretna FC Ltd in the Land Registry, I reckon tearing it free of the hands of the administrator for nowt might well be a non starter. There seems to be a hell of a lot of activists who don't live anywhere near Gretna, and are either getting a buzz from being involved, or simply crave the limelight. If it's the former, then they have a chance. But there is no doubt that despite what some might say, there is definitely more than a difference of opinion going on between the various groups, and non gretna people might be close to be considered hi-jackers of the town's footie team.
I have been fascinated by the story from the get go, but have to admit that it's all becoming tedious and tiresome now. That's reflected in press coverage too, where interest has fallen to the point where locally, they get a wee mention, and nationally, no-one really gives a monkey's any more. Well done Mileson. What a legacy.
A car boot fundraiser........it says it all. Now they are raising cash in the same way as the Cubs and Scouts, and the amount they raise will be on a par with those other organisations. Thing is, there's more than one group raising funds, so who do people donate to?
Here's a thing. Surely the Gretna Supporters Society were tied to the old club. Since that has dissolved, shouldn't they have dissolved too? Do they really have a mandate to just carry on? Sure, their board or committee would have been given the authority to do certain things in support of Gretna FC, but was marching on regardless after the club's demise really within their remit? Not saying they had no right to, or what they have done is wrong, but just wondering if they actually just decided off their own backs to remain the elected ones for the new club. Sure as eggs are eggs, there will be people who won't take to kindly to it if there's even a hint of a new kind of glory hunting in town.
And you have to presume that they have some sort of permission to occupy and charge for table participation in the forthcoming car boot sale at Raydale. Until proven otherwise, the ground does sit with the administrators after all.
Jeez, from taking Steve Tosh away from Aberdeen by paying him more than the Dons could when gretna were in the lower leagues, to car boot sales to generate funds. Oh how the dream has ended...........

Duncan Freemason, on Jun 24 2008, 17:18, said:

Are people actually putting any thought into what they are doing? I mean in detail. I see on top of the car boot sale, where the money is being made solely from charging a fiver to get your car or table in, they are doing a "sponsored walk". Yeah, fine....but is it really fine? There's a form for the walk that reads thus:
GRETNA SUPPORTERS SOCIETY
ACTION GROUP
SAVE OUR CLUB
FUNDRAISING
Sponsored Walk
Sunday 6th.July 2008
Start Time 10.30 a.m.
Start/Finish:Gretna Green Visitors Centre

"Save Our Club". How daft is that? Do they still not get it? Are there people there who are still so blinkered that they think "their club" is still in existance? It's not about "saving" anything.......unless this is yet another offshoot doing their own thing. There is nothing left to save. That has HUGE connotations of throwing good money after bad. If it's a sponsored walk to raise funds to help create a new amateur side in Gretna, then SAY SO. If it's about raising money to go and tilt at windmills in order to save Mileson's Gretna FC, then that's ok then, because that is exactly the message that the sponsored walk organisers are giving out. Not only that, but yet again, the key person is from Hexham, not Gretna. I think the good people of the village are going to get mightily hacked off pretty soon at what looks like a hell of a lot of people from elsewhere telling them what is going to happen in their village when it comes to recreation. Football lover or not, if I lived there, I think I'd be getting pretty pi$$ed off with it already.

To be fair, the Chairman of the Gretna Supporters society (Craig Williamson) is an-ex-Gretna player, Gretna businessman and lives in the village. He's certainly made that point quite forcibly to me in a PM on here. True to say that many of the other activists come from out with Gretna.

Otherwise, I think you're right. The focus in Gretna is with the outside (and futile IMO) possibility of saving Raydale Park for the community; and the setting up of a non-league football team is a side-show. It's not looking good, but I guess until the Gretna Supporters Society have their EGM on the 3rd July, we'll remain in the dark.

[Duncan Freemason]

KingfaetheSooth, on Jun 24 2008, 17:02, said:

To be fair, the Chairman of the Gretna Supporters society (Craig Williamson) is an-ex-Gretna player, Gretna businessman and lives in the village. He's certainly made that point quite forcibly to me in a PM on here. True to say that many of the other activists come from out with Gretna.

Otherwise, I think you're right. The focus in Gretna is with the outside (and futile IMO) possibility of saving Raydale Park for the community; and the setting up of a non-league football team is a side-show. It's not looking good, but I guess until the Gretna Supporters Society have their EGM on the 3rd July, we'll remain in the dark.

So is this sponsored walk by the GSS subset of the "Action Group" to raise money to keep Gretna FC Ltd alive, or is it to set up a new team, or is it to pay lawyers in an attempt to keep Raydale, or is it to raise funds to buy Raydale? I really don't know, and if I were approached and asked to sponsor someone, and I asked "what are you raising money for?".............what would the answer be?

[Pele Tower]

Duncan Freemason, on Jun 24 2008, 18:47, said:

So is this sponsored walk by the GSS subset of the "Action Group" to raise money to keep Gretna FC Ltd alive, or is it to set up a new team, or is it to pay lawyers in an attempt to keep Raydale, or is it to raise funds to buy Raydale? I really don't know, and if I were approached and asked to sponsor someone, and I asked "what are you raising money for?".............what would the answer be?

The sponsored walk was organised when the Supporters Society was indeed trying raise funds to help a new buyer hence to to "save the club." However to be fair things have moved on and the walk will raise funds for the new club.

[Duncan Freemason]

Pele Tower, on Jun 24 2008, 20:06, said:

The sponsored walk was organised when the Supporters Society was indeed trying raise funds to help a new buyer hence to to "save the club." However to be fair things have moved on and the walk will raise funds for the new club.

I really takes little effort to clarify the message. Even the aims of the GSS are meaningless "to gain control of shares in Gretna FC". The cause moves in front of the people. You might have the cause, but it is such a muddled message. It needs to be sorted out or you're gonna be going around kicking one anothers backsides, The message is the only thing you control 100%. And it is being screwed up, and you cannot afford that to happen............but it IS happening.
These "wrong messages" could be sorted out in minutes, but no-one is doing it. That's TWO messages that are there for all and sundry to see, and they are both rubbish. Someone in an "influential 400 strong organisation" should be able to fix that stuff. Somehow or other, this 400 strong group have in reality, been distilled down to maybe a dozen or so.

This post has been edited by Duncan Freemason: 25 June 2008 - 12:05

[Stu]

Gretna being admitted should, for the first month or so at least, attract a reasonable bit of national media interest. It's something the SoS doesn't get enough of - especially when compared to the juniors and the EoS.

[Duncan Freemason]

Stu, on Jun 24 2008, 20:59, said:

Gretna being admitted should, for the first month or so at least, attract a reasonable bit of national media interest. It's something the SoS doesn't get enough of - especially when compared to the juniors and the EoS.

I don't think it will last even a month. That Gretna will be liquidated very soon. This Gretna is a team starting off in an amateur league. Yep, they can pull the strings concerning another club's history for a little while, but I reckon they'll get column inches for a day or two on two weekends and that will become their only week on week coverage at any sort of national level.

[Stu]

Duncan Freemason, on Jun 25 2008, 04:42, said:

I don't think it will last even a month. That Gretna will be liquidated very soon. This Gretna is a team starting off in an amateur league. Yep, they can pull the strings concerning another club's history for a little while, but I reckon they'll get column inches for a day or two on two weekends and that will become their only week on week coverage at any sort of national level.

Think it will last a reasonable time. The Sun sent Gareth Law to cover everything Gretna for the past few years - such as the postman delivering the letters. They even sent him to the States when Deuchar was about to come up against Beckham's side! As a result, they'll almost certainly send him to Wigtown or Stranraer or wherever their first game of the season is.

[RedWeb]

Stu, on Jun 25 2008, 07:51, said:

As a result, they'll almost certainly send him to Wigtown or Stranraer or wherever their first game of the season is.

Mon the Bladders !!

[Hoss]

Andrewinspace, on Jun 18 2008, 21:32, said:

IF Gretna get into the South of Scotland League, do you think they'll contribute much to league in the way of interest and fans?

Or will their support just disapear from where it came from. leaving only the loyal pre-mileson mob?

I personally think they'll be able to muster a decent bit of suppport and certainly will bring a wee bit more attention from the local press to the south league but i think this press attention will die down when their beloved are struggling to make progress in the league by christmas.

Well thats my prediction. But then then again thats even IF they get in.

"IF" you said,when does everyone get to have a definetive answer as to wether they are in the league or not? Seems a lot of speculation.

[Duncan Freemason]

Hoss, on Jun 25 2008, 21:00, said:

"IF" you said,when does everyone get to have a definetive answer as to wether they are in the league or not? Seems a lot of speculation.

That won't be the hard bit. As mentioned earlier, they simply need to be in the area, have a dozen or so players, a footie pitch, and 300 yards of rope. On the FootyMad page and from the site that has supposedly superceded the FootyMad one comes the official announcement that "they are now pinning their hopes on the council "buying Raydale from the administrators". Also a wee lecture for the fans to "get real" in terms of expectations. Lots of stuff about "re-birth" and so on.
There's a few bun fights yet to take place I reckon. Not only that, but the manner in which the statement is made will ensure that some of the more marginal support will walk away.

[Hoss]

Duncan Freemason, on Jun 26 2008, 05:25, said:

That won't be the hard bit. As mentioned earlier, they simply need to be in the area, have a dozen or so players, a footie pitch, and 300 yards of rope. On the FootyMad page and from the site that has supposedly superceded the FootyMad one comes the official announcement that "they are now pinning their hopes on the council "buying Raydale from the administrators". Also a wee lecture for the fans to "get real" in terms of expectations. Lots of stuff about "re-birth" and so on.
There's a few bun fights yet to take place I reckon. Not only that, but the manner in which the statement is made will ensure that some of the more marginal support will walk away.

I understand that Duncan but the fact remains we are only a few weeks away from the start of the season,have they actually applied?.if so when does the league decide? if it comes to a vote surely the stewartry clubs wouldnt fancy midweek trips to Gretna

[Duncan Freemason]

Hoss, on Jun 26 2008, 08:42, said:

I understand that Duncan but the fact remains we are only a few weeks away from the start of the season,have they actually applied?.if so when does the league decide? if it comes to a vote surely the stewartry clubs wouldnt fancy midweek trips to Gretna

I think so, but the people involved are playing things pretty close to their chest. I'm sure the SoS League won't even be too fussy at what point in the proceeding they join. There's no image or TV rights to worry about.......
When they (you) join, that'll be the last big hurrah. There will be a tiny bit of national interest until one game has been played, and then it'll be down to local interest only. I actually think many of the non locals who are active now will fade away once league admission is a done deal. I think it's the involvement that is currently the attraction, and taking part in the week to week mundane stuff will soon wear a few down. I think there will be plans to stick to "Gretna FC", and this is as much a wee kick of defiance as it is anything else.
As to the acquisition of Raydale, then "no news is good news" might well be the motto for now. I've a feeling that isn't going to last for too much longer. Whether or not the council will shell out half a million of the public purse at the behest of a few folks making a noise about their amateur side remains to be seen. Certainly, the club "leasing it from the council" might not go down too well if there is a vision that the leasing is for 100% exclusive use. If nothing else, half a mill could raise the best part of 30k a year in interest. So the "club' better be ready to find two thousand a month to rent it. Of course, highly unlikely. Will more likely have to be renting it for a few hours a week. It's going to get very messy in the next few weeks. If the council go for it, there will be more folks waiting to have a major say in proceedings.....and they won't be talking football, that's for sure.

This post has been edited by Duncan Freemason: 26 June 2008 - 08:45

[Gretna]

IF the new Gretna
are admitted to the South of Scotland League they will NOT be playing in Gretna.

[Jimmy MCcabe]

It's a long hike for Sooth supporters to Fir Park.

[Gretna]

Jimmy MCcabe, on Jun 26 2008, 10:49, said:

It's a long hike for Sooth supporters to Fir Park.