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Team 16?


edinabear

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Well there sort of is because Scotland's population is 5 million and England's is 55 milion. A town of Burton's size 70,000 would be the seventh biggest place in Scotland but only the 113th biggest town/city in England.

If ten percent of the town of burton turn up to watch a game that's 7,000 people paying cash as well as the huge number of potential sponsors etc that are available. Can't get that in a town of 7,000.

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If ten percent of the town of burton turn up to watch a game that's 7,000 people paying cash as well as the huge number of potential sponsors etc that are available. Can't get that in a town of 7,000.

7,000 is a solid third tier crowd in England; 700 is a solid third tier crowd in Scotland.

If a Scottish club were getting 7000 people through the gates each week then they would have seventh highest average attendaces in Scotland but probably the 60th largest in England. 

It's all about size of club in relative terms. Some clubs in Englands 6th tier can get crowds of 3000 but the crowds in Scotland's 6th tier struggle to reach three figures. 

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Well there sort of is because Scotland's population is 5 million and England's is 55 milion. A town of Burton's size 70,000 would be the seventh biggest place in Scotland but only the 113th biggest town/city in England.

Source: http://lovemytown.co.uk/Populations/TownsTable1.asp

So Burton in English terms is akin to Bannockburn, Lerwick, Cove Bay, Wick or Kirkwall  in Scottish terms

 

It costs the same amount of money to run a club and build new stands, maintain pitches, pay tax and VAT whether you're in Burton or Beith, so of course a town the size of Burton can do much better in the league system than a town the size of Beith because they are bigger and can attract more fans and sponsorship to pay largely the same cost as Beith face.

 

You cannot use Burton as an example to beat Junior clubs round the head with.

 

But this isn't about Junior football, it's about Team 16..........

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Back on topic........strange thing is the Threave manager stated publicly not all that long ago that he had a team of players willing to join the club were they to retain their Lowland League status.

 

Makes you wonder why they haven't applied to be the 16th club.  Could it be that they have been advised that St Cuthbert's wont be licensed in time and as such don't have to worry about the prospect of relegation. (doubtful I think).

 

Or have they had a change of heart and decided to take the plunge and regroup playing against more local teams for season starting from scratch.

 

I suspect they knew their application would have been doomed to failure anyway.  A very poor league campaign coupled with having to pull out of a cup tie for being unable to field a side wouldn't have looked the best application on paper.

 

I strongly suspect to see a licensed St Cuthbert replace Threave with Civil Service being announced as the 16th team.

 

Be good to see a revitalised Threave going head to head with Edusport, Wigtown & Bladnoch and Newton Stewart next season in the race for top spot.

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Back on topic........strange thing is the Threave manager stated publicly not all that long ago that he had a team of players willing to join the club were they to retain their Lowland League status.

Makes you wonder why they haven't applied to be the 16th club. Could it be that they have been advised that St Cuthbert's wont be licensed in time and as such don't have to worry about the prospect of relegation. (doubtful I think).

Or have they had a change of heart and decided to take the plunge and regroup playing against more local teams for season starting from scratch.

I suspect they knew their application would have been doomed to failure anyway. A very poor league campaign coupled with having to pull out of a cup tie for being unable to field a side wouldn't have looked the best application on paper.

I strongly suspect to see a licensed St Cuthbert replace Threave with Civil Service being announced as the 16th team.

Be good to see a revitalised Threave going head to head with Edusport, Wigtown & Bladnoch and Newton Stewart next season in the race for top spot.

Grapevine says new Threave manager already left........

Saints will sandbag their licence to ensure they remain a big fish in a small pond. Making a mockery of pyramid

Bet they'd think twice if they knew the parachute payment

Just saying.......

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If for any reason Saints don't go up to the Lowland league ,should Edusorts Academy who finished second in the South of Scotland Legue be given the chance to go up to the Lowland League?

I would guess increased cost in travel, and that their current squad would struggle to compete. I think Edu have applied but I'd rather see a civil or a HRA as they will bring something to the league in regards fans and travelling support. Edu would probably compete the strongest on the field with their Pool of players though

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No matter what way you beat it up, it is about ambition, nothing less.

 

I shouldn't feed the troll but it it depends how you define ambition.

 

At a club like Pollok, ambition means:

 

1. winning our league - which means beating some of the best non-league part-time sides in Scotland.

2. winning the Junior Cup - which means beating some of the best non-league part-time sides in Scotland.

3. The occasional Scottish Cup run - which means winning 1 or 2 to qualify in first place.

 

To go into the Lowland League would mean:

 

1. Making a huge investment in ground improvements - though I think the pitch at 102x64 yds is a problem as would getting floodlights because we are so residential.

2. Playing in a league against opposition of very varying standards in front of poor crowds compared to present when Pollok see good away gates from most teams and also travel well themselves. Heading to Edinburgh every 2nd saturday is just not appealing.

3. The loss of Junior Cup entry

4. No clear pathway back to Junior football if the Lowland League did not work out i.e. doing a Threave. It would mean a 5 division relegation and oblivion as we'd come back in at bottom of West set-up.

5. Following on from 2, the risk of supporters becoming part-time fans, going only to home games and the odd away one when just now a significant number go home and away. This one seems to be hard to understand for fans of SPFL clubs who are happy to be home fans only and do other things on most away days.

 

The clubs that made up the Lowland League at first had everything to gain as their own system needed improving and the change was slight- same opponents and same amount of travelling - it was basically the EoS when Annan, Dalbeattie and Threave all played in it in early 00s. The SFA members were able to put aside money and invest in facilities.

 

For any BIG junior club to consider LL at this point, it would be reckless rather than ambitious. Far more needs to be done in terms of bringing the Juniors and the rest together for it to be a viable destination. Just as a comparison, if a big Atlantic League was formed and top Scottish clubs were invited, would they go without assurances of what league they'd play in upon return? Would Rangers for example go through the seaside league experience all over again? Would any other club want to after finding their plight such a source of amusement? Unless an agreement is made between SJFA and LL that teams from top flight Junior leagues can return in future to top flight Junior leagues, it would be, for me anyway, a risk beyond sense. That's not lack of ambition as I see it.

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Totally understand but look at Annan as a better example when done correctly, Gretna were doing perfectly fine prior to the "living the dream" era

I agree, but Parkgatequeens is suggesting any club could emulate Burton. Which obviously isn't the case.
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...or people just go along to watch their local team as they enjoy watching a game of football with most having senior grade loyalties as well. No huge mystery to what the attraction is I would have thought. If there ever was a pyramid in Scottish football the vast majority of amateur and junior clubs would continue on doing much the same thing as they do now, because that's their niche in the big scheme of things. The number of junior clubs that could ever realistically do a Burton and reach what in Scottish terms would effectively be the top six of the top flight is miniscule to nonexistent. We already have way too many national league clubs as it is, so there are very few Burton and larger sized population centres that don't already have a team in the national divisions. East Kilbride is the only obvious one, but given it's basically Glasgow overspill people there already have teams to follow that are only a few miles away.

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That can happen at any club though. I just feel that supporting a Junior club is like living without expectation or grandeur.

Not just junior clubs, most senior supporters go more in hope than expectation. Juniors have less issues, there are more teams that could win things at that level than in the seniors. Why should the top clubs give that up for the aspiration to play Elgin or or Berwick etc?
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What are you babbling on about.

The vast majority of junior supporters have a senior and junior team.

This has got to be absolute nonsense btw, there is no way you can seriously claim to support two clubs who play at the same time every week.

What is actually meant here is many junior fans are Celtic/sevco fans without the bus fair, these are the degenerates that should never be listened too.

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