pandarilla Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I don't think you're seeing this. Looking at a table at the end (or in.our case, when everyone else still has important games to play) serves as a guide to how it all mapped out.....beating Ireland is only one step of that. The idea that defeating a suposed 'equal' team is an end in itself is precisely the reason persistent and increasingly explicit failures are now met with expectation than dread. Go and gloat to any plastic paddy about our results, im sure if you ask nicely he'll send you a postcard from the Cote d'Azur or Champs-Elysees in the summer. Ok fine, let's get rid. We'll get someone else in and we'll be here again in 2 or 3 years having the exact same argument. Oh what fun. It's the definition of insanity . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkey Tennis Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Ok fine, let's get rid. We'll get someone else in and we'll be here again in 2 or 3 years having the exact same argument. Oh what fun. It's the definition of insanity . I thought that involved changing nothing, but expecting different outcomes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I don't think you're seeing this. Looking at a table at the end (or in.our case, when everyone else still has important games to play) serves as a guide to how it all mapped out.....beating Ireland is only one step of that. The idea that defeating a suposed 'equal' team is an end in itself is precisely the reason persistent and increasingly explicit failures are now met with expectation than dread. Go and gloat to any plastic paddy about our results, im sure if you ask nicely he'll send you a postcard from the Cote d'Azur or Champs-Elysees in the summer. Can I remind you that the campaign we almost succeeded in also had a shite result in Georgia. It also had us robbing points of one of the world's best team (especially the faddy win in Paris - there was f**k all tactical about that goal). Fine, fine margins. This has been our level for some time. Fans 'not accepting it' makes f**k all of a difference (think England's wonderful levels of anguish every time they get papped out a tournament). We need a well-organised team and a bit of luck. Either that or a Gareth bale type figure. I think Strachan has shown enough signs of getting us punching above our weight even if this group didn't work out in the end. I'm not happy but I think he's got more chance of success than anyone else we're capable of attracting to the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I thought that involved changing nothing, but expecting different outcomes. No. Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. (getting rid of Scotland managers after disappointing campaigns) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkey Tennis Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 No. Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. (getting rid of Scotland managers after disappointing campaigns) Changing manager hasn't always failed. Getting rid of Vogts worked - should have happened earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkey Tennis Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I think Strachan has shown enough signs of getting us punching above our weight even if this group didn't work out in the end. I'm not happy but I think he's got more chance of success than anyone else we're capable of attracting to the job. I think that the above conclusions can only be based on a form of blind faith. The only 'punching above our weight' performances would arguably be those against the Poles, although we couldn't win either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CowdenConvert Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I think that the above conclusions can only be based on a form of blind faith.The only 'punching above our weight' performances would arguably be those against the Poles, although we couldn't win either.How is 4 points against ireland not punching above our weight? Where is this delusion coming from that we're so much better than them? Some mental fuckers on here in the last few days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I didn't post here on Thursday as I'd have been too angry. On reflection I think WGS lost the plot in the latter half of this campaign and has to go. I think Scotland is better at football than our recent result show and would like WGS to be replaced with someone who is willing to play in-form players whichever team they turn out for. I'd also prefer it to be a Scot and, frankly, McInnes is the best current Scots manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lex Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Think he just accidentally confirmed he's off after tomorrow Good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No_Problemo Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I didn't post here on Thursday as I'd have been too angry. On reflection I think WGS lost the plot in the latter half of this campaign and has to go. I think Scotland is better at football than our recent result show and would like WGS to be replaced with someone who is willing to play in-form players whichever team they turn out for. I'd also prefer it to be a Scot and, frankly, McInnes is the best current Scots manager. But changing half the team about each game to play in form players is hardly going to work either though..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkey Tennis Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 How is 4 points against ireland not punching above our weight? Where is this delusion coming from that we're so much better than them? Some mental fuckers on here in the last few days. Where do I claim that we're so much better? That's right - nowhere at all. We're certainly not so much worse though that beating them narrowly can be seen as punching above our weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 But changing half the team about each game to play in form players is hardly going to work either though..... I'd be happy with that and if there's a good system there's no reason why form players can't be used. I also think WGS really doesn't respect the domestic game in Scotland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
accies1874 Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I didn't post here on Thursday as I'd have been too angry. On reflection I think WGS lost the plot in the latter half of this campaign and has to go. I think Scotland is better at football than our recent result show and would like WGS to be replaced with someone who is willing to play in-form players whichever team they turn out for. I'd also prefer it to be a Scot and, frankly, McInnes is the best current Scots manager. I think Alex Neil is definitely the best Scottish manager at the moment followed by McInnes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No_Problemo Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I guess we'll never know until we try it but I can't see it working, particularly defensively. Albeit we don't really have enough defenders for it to change too much anyway. Obviously don't have a problem with changing about a couple of forward positions in the starting line up based on form, as long as it suits the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doonhamer doon south Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Maybe we scotland fans have to accept we are not the scotland team that regularly qualified. Look at cyprus and the faroes regularly beating stronger oppisition in name. This campaign has been a failure to a point but I feel it was a tough group (we had world champions yet again along with a strong Poland team) with those fine margins going against us. We should keep him get rid of the over 30's players with a thank you but cheerio and start bring the youth in even if we get beat we must build for the future. End of world cup qualifications we should decide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShawfieldAggro Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 Just when you think people cant be that short-sighted!!! Dropping out-of-form players us an absolute must if getting a place in that team is to have any worth whatsover. Taking a spot for granted has left us with some rank rotten individuals in the position of retaining their spot however their season pans out. I once attended a dinner where the speaker was none other than Tommy Docherty, and in a brief but memorable natter at the bar, he said the easiest part of the Scotland job in 19 fucking 72/3 was weedling out the shite, as they knew they'd have to turn it on for their clubs if he was even going to bother attending matches while picking his squads. Eveb during his short reign, he says he developed a close bond with those players who he knew were keeping themselves in prime condition for EVERY club match, not just the big ones, as he respected the value they held a place in his team with. This was around the time when Broon had to make his decisions on the likes of Hendry, Gallacher, Boyd etc during the 2002 campaign. And its as relevant then as it is now. Far too many players in this current side have an easy ride, which is exsctly why a lot of them play for shit clubs in comparison to Wales and Ireland players. The idea he should be kept because those duds 'back him' or 'like him' is the worst case of dog-wagging from any tail i've ever seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 It's a balance between the two that's needed. I think there will be plenty of examples of players playing very well for country whilst struggling for club - and yet those that want form players picked clearly have a point as well. Laying down clear laws one way or the other isn't the answer. I think wgs is too loyal to some players but I don't see too many obvious flaws in the line ups he's picked recently. Was mcfadden a regular at Everton during his brilliant 07 campaign? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kejan Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I really don't know. I'd certainly like more scrutiny from our so called press though when he avoids answering hard questions, or just laughing at his shitey jokes. Saying all that. I quite like him and wouldn't be too disappointed if he stayed on. Who else is realistically going to take the job with the dinosaurs at the SFA, and the wages on offer? This is the SFA after all who overlooked Lagerback for 4-6-1. Did they even interview him? We aren't particularly in a good way right now, but our WC qualifying group isn't too bad. Lithuania are hopeless, Slovenia are stuttering to the playoffs in a fairly mundane group, Slovakia who started well have hit a bit of a wall although they do have some excellent players, and Malta. Although we do have Malta first, away. It's in September! It'll be far too hot for our professional players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 4-6-1? Even with 12 men we still can't win! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted October 10, 2015 Share Posted October 10, 2015 I think Alex Neil is definitely the best Scottish manager at the moment followed by McInnes. I would agree.....but Alex Neil is beyond our budget plus is looking set to become our next Fergie. He is certainly both hugely impressive and also thoroughly likeable. McInnes has to thole the worst and most needy fans in Scottish football and is doing a brilliant job despite the great handicap placed on him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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