tazz1903 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 Hi , can anyone tell me how this works for this season ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilky1878 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 I think but i'm not 100% sure. Top of Highland League vs Top of Lowland league over two legs. Overall winner vs bottom of League 2 over 2 legs. If the team from League 2 loses they will go into one of the two leagues depending on their location. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shawfield Stallion Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 So what happens if, say, Elgin lose to Spartans in the play off final? If that's how it works, what about the obvious imbalance of having an extra team in the Highland League and a team less in the Lowland League the following season? Do teams actually want to be promoted into the SPFL anyway? Half the mob in the Highland League seem to be pretty content being big fish in a smaller pond Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilky1878 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 So what happens if, say, Elgin lose to Spartans in the play off final? If that's how it works, what about the obvious imbalance of having an extra team in the Highland League and a team less in the Lowland League the following season? Do teams actually want to be promoted into the SPFL anyway? Half the mob in the Highland League seem to be pretty content being big fish in a smaller pond There is a limit to the amount of teams too many or too less in the Highland/Lowland league and things like another junior/amateur team promoted or the border being moved to fix accordingly I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecto Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 Hi , can anyone tell me how this works for this season ? You lot will play-off against either Brora or Spartans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazz1903 Posted July 22, 2014 Author Share Posted July 22, 2014 You lot will play-off against either Brora or Spartans LOL . I really cannae wait till the season starts . you will be told exactly where to stick yer smoked fish . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecto Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 LOL . I really cannae wait till the season starts . you will be told exactly where to stick yer smoked fish . You lot normally stick our smokies in plastic bags and take them home with you, least you have something to enjoy, when I go to Methil all I seem to leave with is heartburn from the pies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 Hi , can anyone tell me how this works for this season ? Highland and Lowland leagues end Saturday 18th April... Assuming both clubs meet the criteria (an Entry licence - which they need to have anyway - plus Bronze floodlights) or have obtained a waiver, or period of grace, they play-off over 2 legs on Saturdays 25th April & 2nd May... Winner of it meets bottom club of SPFL2 over 2 legs on Saturdays 9th & 16th May... If club is relegated it goes to HL if above Tay or LL if below it... HL and/or LL adjust as required. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellow Feet Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 HL and/or LL adjust as required. The problem with this is you could end up with teams like Stirling Uni in the Highland league Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 Stirling cannot go to HL as things stand as there is a fixed boundary. It's exact line of latitude is given on HL website and from what I made out it seems to be the old proposal of "above or beneath the River Tay" with the minor exception that a few towns jsut north of the Tay but in the vicinity of Perth - e.g. Scone - are also in LL area. In practice, unless the Juniors join the pyramid no such towns are currently represented anyway. By adjustment I mean - admit additional clubs or relegate extra clubs, or run 1 club more / 1 club fewer. In the case of LL, there is (right now) the additional safety valve in that they have not yet reached their full complement of 16 clubs. In the case of HL, there is also the potential safety valve in that a proposal was floated, but defeated, earlier this year for 10-10. EDIT: A practical demonstration of this. If (say) Inverurie come up and Elgin go down, nothing much changes. Ditto, if (say) Spartans come up and Queen's Park go down. But if Inverurie come up and Queen's Park go down, HL is 1 club short... they might run short or top-up with (say) Banks o'Dee... and LL is 1 club over... for now not a problem as they've still got 2 vacancies, in future they might run over or relegate an additional club. Ditto but the other way around if Spartans come up and Elgin go down. As more tiers of the pyramid fall into place in time, the readjustment point should of course 'cascade' down to the bottom. e.g. once the EOSL and SOSL fit-in underneath LL, as they surely will, then the readjustment question likely lands-up there instead of LL. It's a natural feature of all pyramids. Practice varies country-to-country, e.g. in England they don't have fixed boundaries, they move the club nearest the boundary from one league (e.g. Conference North) to the other league (in this case Conference South). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazz1903 Posted July 23, 2014 Author Share Posted July 23, 2014 You lot normally stick our smokies in plastic bags and take them home with you, least you have something to enjoy, when I go to Methil all I seem to leave with is heartburn from the pies LOL , that's cause we use steak and premium mince in oor pies .Will take you at least a month to adjust from the Alsatian and bean or the poodle and onion . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazz1903 Posted July 23, 2014 Author Share Posted July 23, 2014 Stirling cannot go to HL as things stand as there is a fixed boundary. It's exact line of latitude is given on HL website and from what I made out it seems to be the old proposal of "above or beneath the River Tay" with the minor exception that a few towns jsut north of the Tay but in the vicinity of Perth - e.g. Scone - are also in LL area. In practice, unless the Juniors join the pyramid no such towns are currently represented anyway. By adjustment I mean - admit additional clubs or relegate extra clubs, or run 1 club more / 1 club fewer. In the case of LL, there is (right now) the additional safety valve in that they have not yet reached their full complement of 16 clubs. In the case of HL, there is also the potential safety valve in that a proposal was floated, but defeated, earlier this year for 10-10. EDIT: A practical demonstration of this. If (say) Inverurie come up and Elgin go down, nothing much changes. Ditto, if (say) Spartans come up and Queen's Park go down. But if Inverurie come up and Queen's Park go down, HL is 1 club short... they might run short or top-up with (say) Banks o'Dee... and LL is 1 club over... for now not a problem as they've still got 2 vacancies, in future they might run over or relegate an additional club. Ditto but the other way around if Spartans come up and Elgin go down. As more tiers of the pyramid fall into place in time, the readjustment point should of course 'cascade' down to the bottom. e.g. once the EOSL and SOSL fit-in underneath LL, as they surely will, then the readjustment question likely lands-up there instead of LL. It's a natural feature of all pyramids. Practice varies country-to-country, e.g. in England they don't have fixed boundaries, they move the club nearest the boundary from one league (e.g. Conference North) to the other league (in this case Conference South). Cheers for the info , I think I get it . well kind o . lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLichtie86 Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 Stirling cannot go to HL as things stand as there is a fixed boundary. It's exact line of latitude is given on HL website and from what I made out it seems to be the old proposal of "above or beneath the River Tay" with the minor exception that a few towns jsut north of the Tay but in the vicinity of Perth - e.g. Scone - are also in LL area. In practice, unless the Juniors join the pyramid no such towns are currently represented anyway. By adjustment I mean - admit additional clubs or relegate extra clubs, or run 1 club more / 1 club fewer. In the case of LL, there is (right now) the additional safety valve in that they have not yet reached their full complement of 16 clubs. In the case of HL, there is also the potential safety valve in that a proposal was floated, but defeated, earlier this year for 10-10. EDIT: A practical demonstration of this. If (say) Inverurie come up and Elgin go down, nothing much changes. Ditto, if (say) Spartans come up and Queen's Park go down. But if Inverurie come up and Queen's Park go down, HL is 1 club short... they might run short or top-up with (say) Banks o'Dee... and LL is 1 club over... for now not a problem as they've still got 2 vacancies, in future they might run over or relegate an additional club. Ditto but the other way around if Spartans come up and Elgin go down. As more tiers of the pyramid fall into place in time, the readjustment point should of course 'cascade' down to the bottom. e.g. once the EOSL and SOSL fit-in underneath LL, as they surely will, then the readjustment question likely lands-up there instead of LL. It's a natural feature of all pyramids. Practice varies country-to-country, e.g. in England they don't have fixed boundaries, they move the club nearest the boundary from one league (e.g. Conference North) to the other league (in this case Conference South). The only problem i can see is what happens over the course of 4 or 5 seasons, A highland league club is promoted and a club that is situated south of the tay are all relegated. That would leave the highland league with 15-16 teams assuming that they dont admit any other teams. no problem. But the Lowland would have 18-19 teams, more than the 16 that is recommended for that league. With no divisions set up below the highland and lowland league as of present to relegate teams to. At present there are 11 out of 42 teams in the SPFL that can be relegated to the Highland League. the other 31 go to the Lowland. Seems a bit bottom heavy. I think there needs to be a third league that overlaps the Lowland and Highland boundry lines so that teams that are relegated can have the option to drop into either 2 of 3 leagues depending on available spaces. And if there is not an available space in the either of the 2 leagues available to that team, then a team from one of those leagues is moved to there other available league in order make space. Obviously some teams should only relistically have 1 league to drop into such as Wick, Berwick, Gretna etc E.G. Brora Rangers are promoted and Berwick are relegated. The HL has 1 space available but the 2 other leagues does not have any spaces available. Montrose is in the Midland League, they are then moved to the HL, and a team from the LL is moved to the ML in order to make room for Berwick in the LL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted July 23, 2014 Share Posted July 23, 2014 The only problem i can see is what happens over the course of 4 or 5 seasons, A highland league club is promoted and a club that is situated south of the tay are all relegated. That would leave the highland league with 15-16 teams assuming that they dont admit any other teams. no problem. But the Lowland would have 18-19 teams, more than the 16 that is recommended for that league. With no divisions set up below the highland and lowland league as of present to relegate teams to. At present there are 11 out of 42 teams in the SPFL that can be relegated to the Highland League. the other 31 go to the Lowland. Seems a bit bottom heavy. I think there needs to be a third league that overlaps the Lowland and Highland boundry lines so that teams that are relegated can have the option to drop into either 2 of 3 leagues depending on available spaces. And if there is not an available space in the either of the 2 leagues available to that team, then a team from one of those leagues is moved to there other available league in order make space. Obviously some teams should only relistically have 1 league to drop into such as Wick, Berwick, Gretna etc E.G. Brora Rangers are promoted and Berwick are relegated. The HL has 1 space available but the 2 other leagues does not have any spaces available. Montrose is in the Midland League, they are then moved to the HL, and a team from the LL is moved to the ML in order to make room for Berwick in the LL. I've no doubt that things will evolve in time. That could include the structure of the leagues themselves but it could also include the rules on the boundaries. Especially if things start tilting HL / LL numbers too heavily. Btw, I would be very surprised if EOSL and SOSL don't fall-in underneath LL even if the Juniors don't, and that could alleviate issues there. Right now I'd suggest there are 3 main problems to doing the sort of thing you suggest... [1] things move pretty slowly in Scottish football, it is only just getting going so it's pretty early to start changing it; [2] they want the tiers below SPFL2 to be licenced and as things stand it's a stretch to get enough to fill the Lowland League nevermind a further licenced division at tier 5; and [3] the Juniors haven't committed to the pyramid yet, and a structure with them will be a lot different to a structure without them. If the Junior leagues do become part of the pyramid then you certainly have the raw material for a 3-league format at tier 5, say North East & West. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilky1878 Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 I've no doubt that things will evolve in time. That could include the structure of the leagues themselves but it could also include the rules on the boundaries. Especially if things start tilting HL / LL numbers too heavily. Btw, I would be very surprised if EOSL and SOSL don't fall-in underneath LL even if the Juniors don't, and that could alleviate issues there. Right now I'd suggest there are 3 main problems to doing the sort of thing you suggest... [1] things move pretty slowly in Scottish football, it is only just getting going so it's pretty early to start changing it; [2] they want the tiers below SPFL2 to be licenced and as things stand it's a stretch to get enough to fill the Lowland League nevermind a further licenced division at tier 5; and [3] the Juniors haven't committed to the pyramid yet, and a structure with them will be a lot different to a structure without them. If the Junior leagues do become part of the pyramid then you certainly have the raw material for a 3-league format at tier 5, say North East & West. Give the juniors 2/3 years and if all goes successfully they may join up. The one thing with the juniors is they have a good set up themselves and wouldn't want to give it up to become part of a very flawed SPFL. SPFL does seem to be on the up so hopefully things keep getting better and the juniors come into the scene. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecto Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 LOL , that's cause we use steak and premium mince in oor pies .Will take you at least a month to adjust from the Alsatian and bean or the poodle and onion . and lovely they are too, don't knock it until you have tried it, just saying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokie1503 Posted July 24, 2014 Share Posted July 24, 2014 LOL , that's cause we use steak and premium mince in oor pies .Will take you at least a month to adjust from the Alsatian and bean or the poodle and onion . i didnt realise you fifers knew what premium steak was Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roker Rover Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 Just seen this rivetting debate and as someone who purchased a pie at Arbroath a few weeks back ( and then got a few free ones in the bar after the game) they are superb. I would go as far as to say they are better than the Killie Pie and I said Aye to a Killie pie. We were disappointed that their was not a smokie pie option on the menu at Arboath though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilky1878 Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 Just seen this rivetting debate and as someone who purchased a pie at Arbroath a few weeks back ( and then got a few free ones in the bar after the game) they are superb. I would go as far as to say they are better than the Killie Pie and I said Aye to a Killie pie. We were disappointed that their was not a smokie pie option on the menu at Arboath though. Wouldn't go as far as to say better than a Killie Pie. The pies at Arbroath were great but about 8 of us all got pies in the group we were in and I think they were all burnt. (Admittedly probably just an unlucky time) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cliftonphil Posted August 3, 2014 Share Posted August 3, 2014 Pyramid system doesn't concern us at Rovers. We won't be anywhere near it. As for pies or other such meat filled pastries then we truly are blessed with the finest from Christies Bakers of Airdrie. Champion Albion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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