[ICEMAN]

Summer football

Season after season we carry on in the S.O.S League week in week out with cancelled fixtures because of our pitches being either sodden or frozen due to the weather. Will we ever wake up and move the season to suit our climate? All summer the pitches are in great condition but no one uses them, we do not have 3g pitches in Dumfries and Galloway so we have to make the best of what we have !. We would get bigger crowds at all our games, midweek games would never be a problem and a lot fewer cancellations. We must be about 70 games behind this season to date.
If we moved the season everyone involved in S.O.S football would then get the chance to follow SPL , 1st, 2nd and 3rd devision teams of their choice on a cold wintery Saturday which would boost their gate numbers. At least try and move the local youth leagues to the summer. I have stood on many a Sunday morning watching young kids frozen trying to keep warm whilst trying to prove their worth! Come on guys at least discuss the possibilty!

[HibeeJibee]

Haven't the clubs discussed an early start (start of July)... potentially even with optional KO cups instead of mandatory fixtures... at the last 2 or 3 AGMs, but it's never gained enough support? That's not anywhere near as radical as moving lock-stock-n-barrel to full-blown summer football would be, but even it hasn't gained sufficient momentum.

[Whitswit]

HibeeJibee, on 28 January 2012 - 23:19, said:

Haven't the clubs discussed an early start (start of July)... potentially even with optional KO cups instead of mandatory fixtures... at the last 2 or 3 AGMs, but it's never gained enough support? That's not anywhere near as radical as moving lock-stock-n-barrel to full-blown summer football would be, but even it hasn't gained sufficient momentum.

Would love to see the South of Scotland make this happen and set a standard I believe the rest of non league football in scotland would follow.

[drumbeg geordie]

Whitswit, on 29 January 2012 - 17:09, said:

Would love to see the South of Scotland make this happen and set a standard I believe the rest of non league football in scotland would follow.

Football is a winter sport in this country and hopefully long will it remain so.

[Whitswit]

drumbeg geordie, on 31 January 2012 - 18:17, said:

Football is a winter sport in this country and hopefully long will it remain so.

But with all due respect - it is utterly ridiculous that we choose to play in the winter. if you were starting a sport from scratch you never would do that. Unless indoor or ice based!

[ICEMAN]

As i have already pointed out with the quality of pitches in our area winter football is a no go ! Newton Stewart is a fine example haven't had a game since the 19th November.

[HibeeJibee]

So why won't clubs even make changes like starting in July...?

Pitch maintanence and player/committee holidays are certainly 1 reason and would be with summer football. Plus what would happen to games postponed after August in a March-November model? How do you manage a proper pre-season in January-February? What about the Scottish Cup? How could it work with the new pyramid system feeding SPL? What about hard pitches?

There are plenty problems, tbh.

[Zorr-oh!]

HibeeJibee, on 31 January 2012 - 23:33, said:

So why won't clubs even make changes like starting in July...?

Pitch maintanence and player/committee holidays are certainly 1 reason and would be with summer football. Plus what would happen to games postponed after August in a March-November model? How do you manage a proper pre-season in January-February? What about the Scottish Cup? How could it work with the new pyramid system feeding SPL? What about hard pitches?

There are plenty problems, tbh.

1. Players and Committee take holidays during the season too.

2. Grass grows during the summer meaning easier maintenance, it is a farce just now trying to get a pitch playable between games.3.If you are arguing that games are going to be posponed after August and that you suddenly cannot do pre season in Feb - March then how can you possibly argue that that is when you should play the season ?
4. The teams who will shortly still be in the Scottish Cup due to clubs having to meet the ground criteria for club licencesing will no doubt be the clubs that put themselves forwards for the propossed Southern/Lowland League or whatever they want to call it . Regardless these teams would just be coming off the end of there season so wheres the problem there.

5.From what I hear , there is very little interest in a pyramid system apart from a few clubs wanting it. With the club licencing kicking in some of the League clubs may be no more so there may be some vacancies there.

6 The Environment Agency have just produced a 2,000 page report saying that winters will become milder with increased rainfall in Scotland, even more than we are getting now!. They also say that the cold weather like the last two winters will also take place periodicaly

7 We are the most Northerly country who play football in the winter, a lot of people I know have stopped going to watch football mainly due to the weather being crap,we cannot ignore that they are saying summer football is way ahead.

[HibeeJibee]

I would take issue with several of your replies... including a complete dodge about what happens in a summer season when games are postponed after August, issues of pitch reseeding, and the main holiday/alternative leisure periods... but the debates are well-worn.

Far less radical even than summer football, SOSFL clubs have voted against even an early July start for 2-3 years running. Why?

This post has been edited by HibeeJibee: 02 February 2012 - 22:54

[only an opinion]

Iceman you are spot on. No football Dec and January. Pre season Febuary, start I'n March. Have a 2 or 3 week break in July and play til November. Stuff the Dinosaurs.

[HibeeJibee]

only an opinion, on 02 February 2012 - 23:18, said:

Pre season Febuary,

Unless February is cold/wet, when you don't get any pre-season, and start completely raw?

only an opinion, on 02 February 2012 - 23:18, said:

Have a 2 or 3 week break in July

So people have to try to holiday in this brief gap, or miss important games? And re-seed and/or re-grow the pitch in this short gap (assuming the've managed to get the council not to close it in the first place if they don't own it). Both June and July are also popular periods for alternative leisure and social pursuits.

only an opinion, on 02 February 2012 - 23:18, said:

and play til November.

Hoping it isn't wet September-October-November.

only an opinion, on 02 February 2012 - 23:18, said:

No football Dec and January.

... unless there were any postponements after August, presumably, since the lack of light nights would force you to reschedule for the weekends after the season was supposed to finish. Which if they were wet/cold, could see you playing up to or beyond New Year, or having to abandon the season?

It's also a headache for sides hoping to reach Scottish Cup R4 (play 2 years solid?), puts clubs out-of-kilter with the rest of the game, and hinders anyone who might ever want to join the pyramid.

As for crowds, it's worth noting they fell in Ireland where their top 2 divisions changed-over; their clubs voted 12-9 to petition FAI to switch back; their regional leagues didn't change.


But one can leave all that aside and simply ask... if clubs won't even start earlier in July, why would they adopt a summer season?

only an opinion, on 02 February 2012 - 23:18, said:

Stuff the Dinosaurs.

It's not about "dinosaurs" though. It's about taking an objective view of the logistical problems of summer football, whether it's optimal or not, and whether it's workable or not.

[Zorr-oh!]

HibeeJibee, on 02 February 2012 - 23:47, said:

Unless February is cold/wet, when you don't get any pre-season, and start completely raw?


So people have to try to holiday in this brief gap, or miss important games? And re-seed and/or re-grow the pitch in this short gap (assuming the've managed to get the council not to close it in the first place if they don't own it). Both June and July are also popular periods for alternative leisure and social pursuits.


Hoping it isn't wet September-October-November.


... unless there were any postponements after August, presumably, since the lack of light nights would force you to reschedule for the weekends after the season was supposed to finish. Which if they were wet/cold, could see you playing up to or beyond New Year, or having to abandon the season?

It's also a headache for sides hoping to reach Scottish Cup R4 (play 2 years solid?), puts clubs out-of-kilter with the rest of the game, and hinders anyone who might ever want to join the pyramid.

As for crowds, it's worth noting they fell in Ireland where their top 2 divisions changed-over; their clubs voted 12-9 to petition FAI to switch back; their regional leagues didn't change.


But one can leave all that aside and simply ask... if clubs won't even start earlier in July, why would they adopt a summer season?



It's not about "dinosaurs" though. It's about taking an objective view of the logistical problems of summer football, whether it's optimal or not, and whether it's workable or not.

Looks like being another great winters day for a game.....not!. Once again most games off and yet you will no doubt say that it would be worse in the summer because of the baking hot sun or the summer monsoons.

[HibeeJibee]

Why on earth would I say that ...? There's a potential for hard pitches, or pitches getting worn-out through lack of summer reseeding/maintanence, but nowhere have I suggested that you would get more postponements in a typical August v a typical February.

You'd get more in a wet August v a mild February... but my previous post sets-out several particular problems with summer football. That's not a primary one.

[Fisherman]

HibeeJibee, on 02 February 2012 - 23:47, said:

Unless February is cold/wet, when you don't get any pre-season, and start completely raw?


So people have to try to holiday in this brief gap, or miss important games? And re-seed and/or re-grow the pitch in this short gap (assuming the've managed to get the council not to close it in the first place if they don't own it). Both June and July are also popular periods for alternative leisure and social pursuits.


Hoping it isn't wet September-October-November.


... unless there were any postponements after August, presumably, since the lack of light nights would force you to reschedule for the weekends after the season was supposed to finish. Which if they were wet/cold, could see you playing up to or beyond New Year, or having to abandon the season?

It's also a headache for sides hoping to reach Scottish Cup R4 (play 2 years solid?), puts clubs out-of-kilter with the rest of the game, and hinders anyone who might ever want to join the pyramid.

As for crowds, it's worth noting they fell in Ireland where their top 2 divisions changed-over; their clubs voted 12-9 to petition FAI to switch back; their regional leagues didn't change.


But one can leave all that aside and simply ask... if clubs won't even start earlier in July, why would they adopt a summer season?



It's not about "dinosaurs" though. It's about taking an objective view of the logistical problems of summer football, whether it's optimal or not, and whether it's workable or not.

Nonsense. Why would a season be abandoned when the amount of fixtures postponed would be less than there are now?

Theres only a few teams at most that would be getting close to scottish cup 4th round.

Its AMATEUR football, who cares if some players go on holiday during the summer, as long as its not the whole team it shouldnt be an argument. People holiday all year round these days.

Summer football will happen one day.

[HibeeJibee]

Fisherman, on 04 February 2012 - 14:17, said:

Nonsense. Why would a season be abandoned when the amount of fixtures postponed would be less than there are now?

In fairness, that's not what I said.

The problem is what happens to any games postponed during the last 3 months of the season, assuming a March-November season as suggested. The midweeks are not light enough to play. Most sides do not have floodlights. You can extend the season, but in doing so you're going into December + January which can be worst of all for postponements.

It is not particularly uncommon for September-October-November to be wet, and therefore postponements to occur.

Fisherman, on 04 February 2012 - 14:17, said:

Theres only a few teams at most that would be getting close to scottish cup 4th round.

Nonetheless it's an ambition for sides from all the non-leagues... HFL, EOS, SOS, + Juniors... and it does seem exceptionally unfair to in essence demand they'd have to play 2 years without a "closed season.

Fisherman, on 04 February 2012 - 14:17, said:

Its AMATEUR football, who cares if some players go on holiday during the summer, as long as its not the whole team it shouldnt be an argument. People holiday all year round these days.

It's semi-professional football. To a lesser degree in the SOS than any of the other Senior/Junior non-leagues, granted. It matters to teams that they can hope to field 'something approaching' their first XI for important parts of the season. People do holiday all year round, but the most popular period is still the summertime.

That said, very few Amateur leagues south of the Highland play summer football either. Border Amateur don't and neither do any of the central belt leagues.

Fisherman, on 04 February 2012 - 14:17, said:

Summer football will happen one day.

Quite possibly. But I think the logistical issues will have been overcome first, as only then will it become workable.

[ICEMAN]

A lot of good points for and against i just think anything that can improve the current situation would be beneficial. And i think alot of our players, officials, committee and supporters would go and follow Queens, Annan, Stranraer or SPL teams on a cold winters saturday as their pitches can cope with the weather. I realise most SOS league officials dont want change but with better playing surfaces comes better quality of football which can only be a good thing so at least try it with the youth game to see how it goes.

This post has been edited by ICEMAN: 05 February 2012 - 22:39

[Gretna Til They Die]

Bear in mind that we are talking about Scotland here, it lashes down in July as much as December.

But on the flip side it isn't (as) Baltic in the summer.

[only an opinion]

Summer Football without a doubt. For goodness sake can we find an association who can show some balls and deliver some leadership.

[Tango Man]

Thought I'd bring this topic back up due to the current weather we have.

Anyone rather watch football in this or are some people still happy to watch it in the freezing cold?

I find it utter nonsense we still play football in the winter, we even make kids play in the winter as well!!

Will we ever see summer football in the SOSL? I hope so.

[drumbeg geordie]

In the summer you can sit all day and watch cricket. bowls and other outdoor summer sports. What on earth would you do in there was no footbal to watch or play in the winter. No suggesting we watch that boring game with a funny shaped ball..

[Tango Man]

drumbeg geordie said:

1337958465[/url]' post='6271577']
In the summer you can sit all day and watch cricket. bowls and other outdoor summer sports. What on earth would you do in there was no footbal to watch or play in the winter. No suggesting we watch that boring game with a funny shaped ball..

Purely talking about SOSL, im not suggesting the SPL etc play in the summer.
Would give the SOSL a massive boost I think.
Tradition is winter, but for the future of the game the summer is the only answer.